Hello From Maarten

[riddertjemaarten]

Hi there,

I’m Maarten from the Netherlands. Michael, many thanks for your website and all the energy you have put in describing what you call Devotional Sex. Reading your website and forum gives great insights and I really like how you have combined different techniques and ancient wisdoms into your concept. I stumbled onto your website a few weeks ago when I was researching selfless (non ejaculatory) sex. Selfless sex where the focus is aimed at the pleasure of one of the partners while the other does not get the same in return. Most of the information if found was more on the extremes, like FemDom, Female Led Relationships, the wearing of chastity devices. Or on the other end by withholding of orgasms by both partners by practicing Karezza. I do not want to judge anyone’s life style, and there is to learn a lot from each, but none of them did appeal to me enough to introduce them in my relation. This is why I liked you website so much, it showed how to combine the different philosophy’s!

A little bit about me. I live together with my wife and our three kids in a small village in The Netherlands (Europe). We both have a professional career, which we combine with the care of our kids. The roles in the household are very balanced and we both do our fair share. Although combining two careers and the care of our very young kids is sometimes an exhausting challenge, but we are very happy with the live we live. The only downside is that our sex live is been very predictable and tame in the past years.

I think it is great that you are willing to share your experiences and ideas on Devotional Sex and started the website and forum. The little “downside” is that it is your way of doing things, and as you say on your website everybody should discover a way to fit the concept in a relationship and find out what works and what not. Therefore I would like to share my experiences on this forum. I hope this is starting point for more people to get past the balanced cuddle for a cuddle and an orgasm for an orgasm type of sex.

Many thanks again Michael!!!

Maarten
(The Netherlands)

PS: I will post also my first experiences. As English is not my native language please excuse me for some mistakes. Expressing feeling s in writing on itself is already difficult even in your own language, but is even more difficult in a strange language. But I will give it a try.

[Devotional Sex]

Hi Maarten, and welcome to the forum!

I'm sure that if your wife is willing to give Devotional Sex a go that you will both enjoy the exploration. Not only will it make things more exciting, but, especially for you, it will become far less predictable.

I look forward to hearing about your experiences. I'm sure that what you share on this forum will help others to follow in your footsteps. But be warned that I may 'steal' any new ideas or ways of doing things that you write about to improve my website.

I do not have any children, so any advice you can share on how to enjoy Devotional Sex when young children are in the house would be appreciated by others in your situation.

Your post is better written than many native english speakers, so I'm sure that you will do ok in future posts.

Happy exploring,
Micahel

[riddertjemaarten]

Thank you Michael, I will come back on the (small) children part. But first I would like to share how things started. I came to notice this site after discovering some of the Devotional sex aspects “by coincidence”.

The first baby steps… (note that baby steps in my case not only means first small steps, but the expected baby was the cause of the experiences that led to the discovery of joys selfless sex) This is what happened:

My wife was pregnant of our third child. For our sex life, this was the best out of the three pregnancies, she is far more comfortable with having sex than the previous times. As we were nearing the end of the pregnancy she was having less and less energy, so after struggling through the day there was not a much energy left to be an active bed partner by the time we went to sleep. Because of her tiredness it happened one time that I gave oral sex to her and she was too tired after her orgasm and asked in a very sorry way if I wouldn’t mind if she went to sleep. I cuddled her in to sleep while still feeling very aroused myself. This arousal didn’t go away the next day and the days that followed. It was like I was completely in love again, the slightest touch from her or looking deeply into her beautiful brown eyes made shiver all over my body. I felt I was the happiest man in the world being with this beautiful women who is carrying our baby. She also noticed the difference and said she felt that we were more closer to each other. But good things come to an end, a few days later id give myself an orgasm in the shower one morning. I was back where I was before, just the normal feelings, I even got a bit grumpy, when she asked where that came from I told her some lousy excuses about stress at work. I did not want to molest her with my problems. But my grumpiness continued and eventually led to a bigger argument. Later that evening in bed I explained to her what happened to my feelings. She said that I should have expressed this earlier if it was bothering me so much. She was right but I found it difficult to come forward with my feelings while she was the carrying the biggest load on her shoulders at that moment. Later that evening we made love, doing oral on her and after a few climaxes for her and cuddling we went to sleep, I did not sleep that night but enjoyed being in each other’s arms, this great feeling was back! A few days later, making love, she gave oral on me and did finish me off manually. I had the most intense orgasms I ever experienced. I could not believe this being so intense even without having intercourse. Normally my orgasms trough intercourse are more intense, but this was more, way more, intense.

The experiences kept running through my head, I was completely flabbergasted by the intensity of the feelings I experienced and the increased attraction to my wife and the joys of being together with my family were also intensified. Looking on the internet for withholding male orgasms I came across BDSM, FemDom, , Loving Female Authority, Female Led Relations, Male Chastity, Karezza etc… In all of them orgasm control is one of the main aspects. Still I was not very attracted to these concepts/life styles. Only the mild variations Loving Female Authority stood out a bit, mainly because I truly enjoyed the selfless type of sexuality often practised in these life styles. On the other hand I could not get around the FLR view on relations (men doing all the housework while wife going out with friends etc.) . So yes accepting the wife’s authority in the sexuality of the relationship feeds my imagination but the other aspects do fancy me less. We also are both very happy with our relation and how everything works between us. My wife mentions this point a lot when she compares our household with others she says she is so happy with the equal balance.

Here is where the devotional sex comes in, reading the outline on the website felt like coming home! It describes the feelings I experienced and the ways I would like to give them a place in our relationship and discuss this with my wife. I’m doubting very much when to bring this discovery to my wife. For the moment she is recovering from giving birth and our new baby (three weeks ago) and together with the other two children the family is asking our full attention. This will get better when the baby will have full night sleeps, till that moment there are not so much intimate moments for discussion.

At the moment it are just small thing that are happening. I think that even being small they are very important, the seed is planted and has to grow bit by bit. A few of the things that happened:
• My wife is now aware of my reactions on (non-) orgasming. We did some cuddling before sleeping and she played with my Desire but I did not climax. The next day I gave her a big cuddle in the kitchen and she said with a big smile: “Where do this big cuddles come from?” We did not need more words to understand what she meant, she just give an eye blink. The downside is that when I’m grumpy she relates it to my orgasm, I really need to work on that one.
• One day, giving me a manual, after I came, she spontaneously said that she was trying to stop just before I would come. I was surprised, we never discussed this, it was her idea! I said “really?”, well she said she would het given eventually but she would have liked to tease me. I was speechless…
• In the second week after giving birth we were just cuddling and kissing in bed before going to sleep when by accident our legs twisted in such a way that I touched her Pleasure with my knee, she gave a moan, I was shocked and retrieved my knee but she quickly pulled it back we started to ride it slowly while she was saying she did not imagine this could have felt this good. I went down with my hand little by little and asked if it was ok to enter her panties. That was ok, only applying pressure and slow movements on the top she enjoyed it very much and reached an orgasm. She asked if I was ok and we went to sleep while cuddled here a bit. The next night I was given an orgasm (in return?). It never happened that we had any sexual activity so quick after giving birth. I think she is now more relaxed having sexual activity knowing she can enjoy it without the obligation of doing something in return. Although I think she might feel some guild, because in the next days I get my orgasm.
• My wife is still on maternity leave and now ill with some fever, the other kids are at day care, so only feeding the baby and watching some TV (we have a video on demand service on our cable network which allows to see all the TV shows from the past 14 days). When I came home from work she mentioned the TV show (which is about sex and drugs – “Spuiten en Slikken” for the Dutch readers) she saw that day in which there was an item on giving oral sex. During this last pregnancy we moved from penetrative sex to more and more oral because towards the end she did no find it comfortable to have penetrative sex. By recalling the subject she might have mentioned that she is still on that path. Of course I looked the show and fast- forwarded it to the item she mentioned. It was more on going slow and teasing and not aiming directly at your goal and some street interviews. Being only a few minutes the subject was not covered that deeply. So I think it was just more a reminder form her. Unfortunately still recovering and now being ill as well, no orals at this moment, but I’m curios what the future will bring!
• Some nights is give het backrubs in bed or I will cuddle whole her body while she is falling asleep. When I ask her if she does not mid or finds it disturbing doing this while she wants to sleep, she says that she likes it very much.

I think she has other things on her mind, and me also, there is so few time left for each other at the moment. For the moment I am very happy how things are going. I don’t know what the next step will be. First our sex live should become normal again, as we were moving towards more oral I would like it to keep that way, but it is now me deciding not wanting to orgasm. For me the next step would me to turn that around and leave the decision up to her. Let’s see what the future brings !

Maarten

[Devotional Sex]

Hi again Maarten,

Thanks for sharing your story. You have a wonderful relationship with your wife!

I would say that you are already exploring Devotional Sex, and clearly you have BOTH found some benefits.

I suggest that you wait until your wife is ready for an intimate discussion, and then tell you that you have found this website, and that, if she is willing, you would like to explore some of this with her.

Of course it is great if she wants to read the website, but I've found that my Princesses have all preferred to have me tell them about it. It is likely that you will be keen to tell her more than she wants to know, and you will be able to answer all her questions. (If you don't find an answer on the website just ask on the forum).

You are clearly sensitive to how your wife feels, so hopefully it will be easy to not go too fast. And remember any exploration is likely to include a few times of going backwards, so don't get discouraged if there are one or two problems.

Though you have made great progress informally, you might find that things work even better when you both agree that you will have a session or a season of Devotional Sex. A season of Devotional Sex is your promising to obey your Princess until she has you ejaculate, and this may not be until after several sessions of sexual activity.

Once a Season is over you might go back to normal for a few days or weeks until you both want to start another Season. Maybe one day you will both enjoy your Seasons of Devotional Sex so much that you both want the end of one Season to be the beginning of the next - at which stage you will be living Devotional Sex.

Part of your giving her control, and her learning to be relaxed about having this control, is that you can then open up and be fully honest about your feelings and what you would like. Let her know that times of 'denial' are made up for by the later rewards (not ejaculating for a few days means that when you do it is much more powerful, and an evening of giving her oral sex and then just cuddling with her holding your erection makes you feel very close to her, etc).

You said "I think she is now more relaxed having sexual activity knowing she can enjoy it without the obligation of doing something in return." This is key to her feeling and acting like a Princess - and you seem to informally be there already!

Another bit of Devotional Sex that may work very well when you are both busy and there are children are Blissettes. Because you don't ejaculate often, your wife will be able to get you hard very quickly. So when she has a spare few minutes she can decide to enjoy a single sexual activity for a few minutes and then end it without things going any further. So, for example, on a morning when there is not time for a longer session of sex, you can enjoy one person giving the other oral sex for a minute or two, and then get up.

Hopefully your wife will also be pleased to learn that what you have been exploring has got a name.

I can forward any questions she has to Princess Ada if she wants a woman's view about anything.

A key to getting Devotional Sex working well is good communication. I'm pretty sure that without doing things very differently from what you have already enjoyed together, just formalising it and sharing your feelings and desires will take things to a much higher level.

Happy exploring, and please write back and let us all know how things go.

[Devotional Sex]

Hi again Maarten,

A few further comments.

In your first post you talked about "selfless (non-ejaculatory) sex". I'll be fully honest and tell you that I practice Devotional Sex because I find that it gives ME greater pleasures, satisfaction, excitement, and intimacy. So you could say that, even though I have fewer ejaculations, because I'm choosing to do this, and I feel I'm a winner, what I do is selfish sex

Of course the only reason I've found so many women who have enjoyed Devotional Sex with me is that this technique has huge rewards for my partners as well.

I very much enjoy receiving pleasures, and I find that with my higher erotic energy from fewer ejaculations my enjoyment of receiving pleasures is much greater. But a key to the success of Devotional Sex is that I also enjoy pleasuring my partner. If we have a session where all we do is me give her oral sex and then end with a cuddle with her holding my erection, she clearly enjoys this. But I have enjoyed giving her oral sex, and I absolutely love it when she takes hold of my erection when we cuddle, and I really enjoy the intimate cuddle powered by my high erotic energy and desire for her.

So the secret of success of Devotional Sex is that it is WIN-WIN.

I think that win-win is the best way to present this to your wife. You should make clear to her that part of any exploration of Devotional Sex is finding out what SHE likes. When you make suggestions of what can happen with Devotional Sex it is important that you mention anything that you think she might like, even if it is something that you might not particularly like.

If you give her the impression that it is all about HER, then she may feel rejected as a loving wife who wants to please and pleasure her husband. So let her know that whilst the first bit of the definition of a Princess is that she uses her power over you to have fun and enjoy sensual and sexual pleasures, the second bit of the definition is that she must keep you eager to remain her Knight. Part of this is giving you the standard sexual pleasures, but over time you can let her know that some things that make you feel under her power also give you great pleasure.

A benefit of her keeping you horny is that you will always be eager to give her sensual pleasures such as a foot massage. For her receiving a foot massage may be just relaxation, but for you it will have some sexual energy. If the kids are not around, you could let her know that it would make you feel much more hers if she sometimes had you be naked while you gave her the foot massage. Perhaps your wife will love the idea of having you be naked. But perhaps she might make you be naked every once in a while mainly just to please you and make you feel like her Knight.

Giving your wife a foot massage in the living room (with you clothed) is the sort of devotional activity which you might feel is ok to do when the kids are around. And it has a side benefit to a Knight that a foot massage relaxes a tired Princess and this makes it more likely that she will feel like some sexual activity later on.

As you say, the next big step is to try your first formal Season of Devotional Sex where you promise to obey her sensual and sexual wishes, and she decides when the Season will end by having you ejaculate.

Good communication is important, so it is good to discuss with your Princess how you feel about ejaculating. At times you might say "It is challenging, but I would really like to go a day or two longer", or "I think I really need to cum tonight". Very often your Princess will take your advice.

If you do several Seasons you will find a time when you really want to keep the Season going but she decides to end it by making you cum. That is an important part of her power.

A very powerful moment of truth will be the first time you say "I'm desperate to cum tonight" and your Princess says "Not tonight, I want you charged up for at least another day".

Of course you need to agree that starting a Season of Devotional Sex means that you cannot make yourself cum without her permission. If she looses interest at the end of a Season, it is best to tell there that you need to cum, and say that if she allows you to cum, you would prefer to share it with her. Let her know that it is ok for her to tell you to play with yourself to make you cum."

Don't make a big fuss about commands. I have found that it works well if you tell your Princess about the Ritual command, and then when she asks for oral sex the long way, just remind her that all she needs to say is "Ritual". Once they have used the command once or twice it becomes a natural and easy way for her to tell you eat them, and her using a whole sentence seems far too wordy.

I've probably said far too much, so forgive my keenness to help you take the next step.

I look forward to hearing how thing progress. Happy exploring!

[riddertjemaarten]

Thanks for your response and ideas Michael,

Yes things have to go slow, time and energy levels are NOT friends at the moment.

You are right about being selfless is in fact also selfish. I never knew the differences in mood an orgasm could make. It sounds like a big contradiction, but for me less orgasms (but not less stimulation) make me feel better (in all aspects of life). And sometimes I feel also guilty about it because it gives me a feeling of not allowing my wife to do nice things to me. I will need to move from ME to US. Thank you for the advice not to move too much towards being it all about HER when bringing the subject. That could scare her of and in realty it is all about US. I think what needs to change is our view on sexuality and that it not always needs to be an equal physical exchange to make it fulfilling for both of us. But to understand and learn how unbalanced physical aspects make great mental rewards (and are fun). As said I’ll have to move to US, and my wife’s view and feeling on things are very important to reach a next step, but intimate moments are now scare. So for the moment I’ll try spoil my wife with lots of cuddles, attention and all the help I can give. And enjoy being parents of a lovely baby of course.

If it will lead to some sort of Devotional Sex in the future I don’t know, we will have to explore, I can’t speak for my wife and I even don’t know it myself. But your website gives a lot of inspiration on how a relationship (or sex) dynamic can develop. And from our past experiences I’m sure things will change.

[Devotional Sex]

Great to hear from you again Maarten, and I'm pleased that things are going well with the new baby.

I've nothing to add to what you just wrote (which is unusual for me), so all I can do is wish you both luck.

I hope you continue to keep the forum up-to-date with your progress. Even if you don't end up with Devotional Sex, I think your journey will be educational for all, and you never know what advice other readers of this forum may one day add.

[riddertjemaarten]

A little update from me.

Not very very much progress has been made. Energy and time go into other things at this moment. And as my wife is getting more energetic I'm getting more orgasms. She likes giving them. What has been changed is that i do not orgasm in between our love making sessions. And during love making she is the one getting the first orgasm (and more) before I cum. This has been very beneficial for our love making.

I want to take things further within a few months, discussing the subject now would be a wrong idea. But I'm happy because things are better than before!

[Devotional Sex]

Thanks for the update.

It's great that things are better than before.

The trend for technologies which change our lives (DVD players, mobile phones, the internet) is that the technology prophets overestimate the short-term take-up but underestimate the long-term take-up and impact. Your going slowly with moving forward might be similar in that things have not progressed as far as fantasy, but the steady progress may lead to very significant changes in a few years.

Things that might change your wife's mind about making you ejaculate so often are:
1 - her accepting that you sometimes like to have her say no,
2 - if you learn to orgasm without ejaculating then she can make you orgasm (many times) without your ejaculating,
3 - her discovering that if you have sex on Friday night, and she does not let you ejaculate, then Saturday and Sunday can be lots of fun for her.
4 - and that giving you an ejaculation after some denial makes the ejaculation a much bigger and more significant event for you both.

Though you can tell her all these things, the really only start to make a big difference when she learns that they are true. And that takes time.

Good luck with your journey, and please provide another update once there is some new news.

[newlover]

Hot topic. Love this stuff. Thanks for sharing....